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	<title>Comments on: In Conversation with Iain Dale</title>
	<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/</link>
	<description>Not about wood or vegetables</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 10:45:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: An Informed Electorate &#124; Big Sticks and Small Carrots</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-2560</link>
		<dc:creator>An Informed Electorate &#124; Big Sticks and Small Carrots</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 18:48:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-2560</guid>
		<description>[...] don&#8217;t intend to press Iain further as we should all be aware by now that my attempting to do so will only lead to him calling me obsessive, a stalker, or a [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] don&#8217;t intend to press Iain further as we should all be aware by now that my attempting to do so will only lead to him calling me obsessive, a stalker, or a [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: The Big Day Out &#124; Big Sticks and Small Carrots</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-1771</link>
		<dc:creator>The Big Day Out &#124; Big Sticks and Small Carrots</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Dec 2007 17:27:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-1771</guid>
		<description>[...] proof - as if it were needed - that Iain Dale was right to call me one of Tim&#8217;s &#8220;sockpuppets&#8221; and part of a vast left-wing [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] proof - as if it were needed - that Iain Dale was right to call me one of Tim&#8217;s &#8220;sockpuppets&#8221; and part of a vast left-wing [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Lobster Blogster</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-993</link>
		<dc:creator>Lobster Blogster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 18:28:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-993</guid>
		<description>No, I'm sticking with delusional. He said it in private, to the one person who would know whether what he was saying was true or not, without having to refer elsewhere. It's garbled, and it's false. It mixes both rational type and emotional type arguments. It seeks to undermine you. It muddles what is clear to a wider audience, with what is clear to him. I am assuming that this, or a statement like this has never been uttered about the three of you before, so it means that Dale is implicitly implying that what he "knows" is also known widely by other in the outside world. Yet since this is actually the first time the statement has been made, it can't possibly be so.

I don't expect we'll ever agree about this, so I'll move on now. I have my own thoughts about what motivates Dale, so I thank you for encouraging me to go a bit deeper into his psyche than I would have done on my own. I'll leave you to your blog in peace.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, I&#8217;m sticking with delusional. He said it in private, to the one person who would know whether what he was saying was true or not, without having to refer elsewhere. It&#8217;s garbled, and it&#8217;s false. It mixes both rational type and emotional type arguments. It seeks to undermine you. It muddles what is clear to a wider audience, with what is clear to him. I am assuming that this, or a statement like this has never been uttered about the three of you before, so it means that Dale is implicitly implying that what he &#8220;knows&#8221; is also known widely by other in the outside world. Yet since this is actually the first time the statement has been made, it can&#8217;t possibly be so.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t expect we&#8217;ll ever agree about this, so I&#8217;ll move on now. I have my own thoughts about what motivates Dale, so I thank you for encouraging me to go a bit deeper into his psyche than I would have done on my own. I&#8217;ll leave you to your blog in peace.</p>
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		<title>By: Garry</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-992</link>
		<dc:creator>Garry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 13:44:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-992</guid>
		<description>We could do a book called "The Dale Delusion"...

But seriously, he knows exactly what he's doing. The quote there was simply an attempt to delegitimise my questions. All the evidence suggests that the root of the problem is that Iain believes he can say anything he likes on his blog and get away with it.

If he's going to continue to spin ridiculous yarns for party political advantage while pretending to have a proper blog which allows readers to challenge his claims in a reasonable way, he's going to continue to get called on it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We could do a book called &#8220;The Dale Delusion&#8221;&#8230;</p>
<p>But seriously, he knows exactly what he&#8217;s doing. The quote there was simply an attempt to delegitimise my questions. All the evidence suggests that the root of the problem is that Iain believes he can say anything he likes on his blog and get away with it.</p>
<p>If he&#8217;s going to continue to spin ridiculous yarns for party political advantage while pretending to have a proper blog which allows readers to challenge his claims in a reasonable way, he&#8217;s going to continue to get called on it.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Ireland</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-990</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Ireland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:15:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-990</guid>
		<description>I've encountered the 'delusion' problem before (with Dennis Paul for example). The person appears to be sincere in their belief in the fiction(s) they've created, but you can't ignore the very real possibility that they are simply trying to lie convincingly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve encountered the &#8216;delusion&#8217; problem before (with Dennis Paul for example). The person appears to be sincere in their belief in the fiction(s) they&#8217;ve created, but you can&#8217;t ignore the very real possibility that they are simply trying to lie convincingly.</p>
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		<title>By: Lobster Blogster</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-989</link>
		<dc:creator>Lobster Blogster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 08:05:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-989</guid>
		<description>Sorry Garry, but on point 2 we have to disagree. I think that when he says:

&lt;i&gt;"Garry, it is clear that Ireland is using you and Scotch as his sock puppets. If you want to lower yourself to that level that’s your decision."&lt;/i&gt;

it's delusional.

I should have said I came to my own conclusions about his mental well-being, and this was before I had read your blog. In any case, I read your comment about "mental illness" to be a joke about your own behaviour, not his.

BTW, if you take a look at my blog, I make no pretences about my own mental stability. Being "off your rocker" is a perfectly respectable place to be, but you should make efforts not to annoy others unnecessarily when you are there. I make a special exception for Dale, though, maybe because he's such a frothing at the mouth Tory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry Garry, but on point 2 we have to disagree. I think that when he says:</p>
<p><i>&#8220;Garry, it is clear that Ireland is using you and Scotch as his sock puppets. If you want to lower yourself to that level that’s your decision.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>it&#8217;s delusional.</p>
<p>I should have said I came to my own conclusions about his mental well-being, and this was before I had read your blog. In any case, I read your comment about &#8220;mental illness&#8221; to be a joke about your own behaviour, not his.</p>
<p>BTW, if you take a look at my blog, I make no pretences about my own mental stability. Being &#8220;off your rocker&#8221; is a perfectly respectable place to be, but you should make efforts not to annoy others unnecessarily when you are there. I make a special exception for Dale, though, maybe because he&#8217;s such a frothing at the mouth Tory.</p>
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		<title>By: Garry</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-984</link>
		<dc:creator>Garry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Oct 2007 00:20:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-984</guid>
		<description>LB, I suspect you meant it in a humorous way but I'm going to have to adopt a stern tone about part of your comment. I can't agree with the suggestion that Iain is in any way mentally ill. I object for two reasons:  

1. I do not operate down at Iain's level and have no wish to encourage anyone else to either. Quite the opposite, in fact.
2. I do not agree. Iain shows no signs of mentally illness. He knows exactly what he's doing.

Feel free to comment but please don't post any more accusations of that sort, even if meant humorously.

[Stern Tone Off]

Like many people, I do feel strongly about those who judge others by standards they themselves to do not meet. I also have a strong aversion to being fobbed off. 

On the post, don't worry about this consuming me too much. As the conversation with Iain unfolded and he repeatedly attempted to fob me off, I realised that a post would pretty much write itself. It did. I've taken longer to write shorter pieces than this.

Also, I now have a post I can refer back to if and when I decide to write about his antics in the future. I doubt he's going to stop posting silliness like his &lt;a href="http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/15/tory-spin-merchant-caught-out-over-pmqs-edit/" rel="nofollow"&gt;4:3 format is a Vast Left Wing Conspiracy&lt;/a&gt; blunder. As you say, hard to resist pointing out the absurdity and irony in that sort of thing. Anyone who queries the tone of any future posts or asks why I didn't try to discuss whatever it might be in the comments at IDD can now be directed here. It  might even be a time saver.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LB, I suspect you meant it in a humorous way but I&#8217;m going to have to adopt a stern tone about part of your comment. I can&#8217;t agree with the suggestion that Iain is in any way mentally ill. I object for two reasons:  </p>
<p>1. I do not operate down at Iain&#8217;s level and have no wish to encourage anyone else to either. Quite the opposite, in fact.<br />
2. I do not agree. Iain shows no signs of mentally illness. He knows exactly what he&#8217;s doing.</p>
<p>Feel free to comment but please don&#8217;t post any more accusations of that sort, even if meant humorously.</p>
<p>[Stern Tone Off]</p>
<p>Like many people, I do feel strongly about those who judge others by standards they themselves to do not meet. I also have a strong aversion to being fobbed off. </p>
<p>On the post, don&#8217;t worry about this consuming me too much. As the conversation with Iain unfolded and he repeatedly attempted to fob me off, I realised that a post would pretty much write itself. It did. I&#8217;ve taken longer to write shorter pieces than this.</p>
<p>Also, I now have a post I can refer back to if and when I decide to write about his antics in the future. I doubt he&#8217;s going to stop posting silliness like his <a href="http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/15/tory-spin-merchant-caught-out-over-pmqs-edit/" rel="nofollow">4:3 format is a Vast Left Wing Conspiracy</a> blunder. As you say, hard to resist pointing out the absurdity and irony in that sort of thing. Anyone who queries the tone of any future posts or asks why I didn&#8217;t try to discuss whatever it might be in the comments at IDD can now be directed here. It  might even be a time saver.</p>
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		<title>By: Lobster Blogster</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-981</link>
		<dc:creator>Lobster Blogster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 23:17:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-981</guid>
		<description>Garry, your patience at trying to hold a conversation with Dale has to be admired. I came to the conclusion some time ago that he was both ill-mannered and poorly educated, and that there is little point in trying to reason with him. Then I found something which seemed to suggest he had a degree, so it appears that his is a case of poor manners really showing through. The trouble is the nonsense he spouts is almost irresistable. The latest piece of daftness I've tried to tackle with a comment is this post:

http://iaindale.blogspot.com/2007/10/why-did-bbc-not-name-shamed-labour-mp.html

He takes the BBC to task for not naming an MP who is (in his words) "reprimanded" by a committee. But on reading the report (which he even links to) you find that the complaint wasn't actually upheld. To be honest, I can't help laughing when I see such clangers, and I am now starting to believe the man is barking mad.

I hope you don't take this last little bit as a lecture. From the length of your post I can tell this was something you just had to get off your chest. If the guy really is off his rocker, I am afraid not amount of reasoning with him will help, and indulging in too much of it may actualy be injurous to your health. I'm not putting it quite as bluntly as "get a life", but try not to let it consume you too much    :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Garry, your patience at trying to hold a conversation with Dale has to be admired. I came to the conclusion some time ago that he was both ill-mannered and poorly educated, and that there is little point in trying to reason with him. Then I found something which seemed to suggest he had a degree, so it appears that his is a case of poor manners really showing through. The trouble is the nonsense he spouts is almost irresistable. The latest piece of daftness I&#8217;ve tried to tackle with a comment is this post:</p>
<p><a href="http://iaindale.blogspot.com/2007/10/why-did-bbc-not-name-shamed-labour-mp.html" rel="nofollow">http://iaindale.blogspot.com/2007/10/why-did-bbc-not-name-shamed-labour-mp.html</a></p>
<p>He takes the BBC to task for not naming an MP who is (in his words) &#8220;reprimanded&#8221; by a committee. But on reading the report (which he even links to) you find that the complaint wasn&#8217;t actually upheld. To be honest, I can&#8217;t help laughing when I see such clangers, and I am now starting to believe the man is barking mad.</p>
<p>I hope you don&#8217;t take this last little bit as a lecture. From the length of your post I can tell this was something you just had to get off your chest. If the guy really is off his rocker, I am afraid not amount of reasoning with him will help, and indulging in too much of it may actualy be injurous to your health. I&#8217;m not putting it quite as bluntly as &#8220;get a life&#8221;, but try not to let it consume you too much    <img src='http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Garry</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-979</link>
		<dc:creator>Garry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 21:05:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-979</guid>
		<description>Chris, he does love to use the "O" word, doesn't he? 

Loving your last paragraph, btw.

I see that Iain has now deleted some of the images including the one I'd linked to in my last comment. Hands up who thinks he'll offer an genuine apology for claiming copyright on someone else's work and spending eight months ignoring the request that he stop doing so.

(Clue: he doesn't appear to have removed the © tag from all the other artwork by all the other people. And I only had a quick glance but he's missed at least one of Tim's.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris, he does love to use the &#8220;O&#8221; word, doesn&#8217;t he? </p>
<p>Loving your last paragraph, btw.</p>
<p>I see that Iain has now deleted some of the images including the one I&#8217;d linked to in my last comment. Hands up who thinks he&#8217;ll offer an genuine apology for claiming copyright on someone else&#8217;s work and spending eight months ignoring the request that he stop doing so.</p>
<p>(Clue: he doesn&#8217;t appear to have removed the © tag from all the other artwork by all the other people. And I only had a quick glance but he&#8217;s missed at least one of Tim&#8217;s.)</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Paul</title>
		<link>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-978</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Oct 2007 20:28:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sticksandcarrots.net/2007/10/27/in-conversation-with-iain-dale/#comment-978</guid>
		<description>Phew! Thanks goodness. Dale didn't slag me off in this exchange. 

Though he did call me Tim's mini-me on mine. I really don't know what the answer is to Mr Dale. Leaving the politics aside he is continually inaccurate and careless, he rarely corrects his mistakes or apologises over false allegations, he jeers and sneers often proactively, he doesn't do the right thing on hat tips and credits, he is forever accusing others of being obsessive or mad or pathetic or rude or "typical", he thinks he is the only thing I ever blog about as he doesn't look at the other 80%, and last Monday he was incredibly rude to Rupa Huq on his mass media TV programme when she wanted to talk about my post about George Galloway. 

Dale said: "Oh, he is obsessed" in a totally non-obsessed way thankfully. You'd think he'd be glad I'd blogged about someone else.

He puts himself at the centre of the solar system and is continuously up himself and then he complains that we planets and moons don't orbit his greatness in silence and/or awe, or with fulsome praise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phew! Thanks goodness. Dale didn&#8217;t slag me off in this exchange. </p>
<p>Though he did call me Tim&#8217;s mini-me on mine. I really don&#8217;t know what the answer is to Mr Dale. Leaving the politics aside he is continually inaccurate and careless, he rarely corrects his mistakes or apologises over false allegations, he jeers and sneers often proactively, he doesn&#8217;t do the right thing on hat tips and credits, he is forever accusing others of being obsessive or mad or pathetic or rude or &#8220;typical&#8221;, he thinks he is the only thing I ever blog about as he doesn&#8217;t look at the other 80%, and last Monday he was incredibly rude to Rupa Huq on his mass media TV programme when she wanted to talk about my post about George Galloway. </p>
<p>Dale said: &#8220;Oh, he is obsessed&#8221; in a totally non-obsessed way thankfully. You&#8217;d think he&#8217;d be glad I&#8217;d blogged about someone else.</p>
<p>He puts himself at the centre of the solar system and is continuously up himself and then he complains that we planets and moons don&#8217;t orbit his greatness in silence and/or awe, or with fulsome praise.</p>
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